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Surrounding the JonBenet Ramsey Murder case

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This web page is part of a series covering found materials regarding individuals, items or events that apparently became part of what is commonly known as the vortex of the JonBenet Ramsey murder case Christmas night 1996. The webmaster of this site claims no inside official Boulder police information as to who has been interviewed, investigated, the outcome or what information is actually considered official evidence. These pages outline found material which can include but not limited to materials found in books, articles, the Internet, transcripts, depositions, legal documents, Internet discussion forums, graphics or photos, media reports, TV/Radio shows about the JonBenet Ramsey murder case. Found materials are here for historical archive purposes. (www.acandyrose.com - acandyrose@aol.com)
This webpage series is for historical archive and educational purposes on found materials


Gloria Williams

John Ramsey Affair in the late '70s


JonBenet Ramsey Murder Case
Gloria Williams
Individual Date Reference Key ? Gave Prints Gave Blood Gave Hair Handwriting Got DNA Cleared or Alibi
Gloria Williams
(Atlanta, Georgia)
(John Ramsey Mistress)
John Ramsey had affair with her in the late 70s. Nedra, Pam and Paula all knew about her but not Patsy. John said it ws one of those "fatal attraction" type things. John "dumped" Gloria in '79 when he met Patsy.
She worked 3-4 years for Ramsey as secretary at Southern Peripherals Instruments

She had nine year old son, Scott or Mark Williams ??
John Ramsey
April 30, 1997
Interview
Patsy Ramsey
April 30, 1997
Interview
John Ramsey
June 1998
Interview
PMPT Pg254sb
ST Pg173
ST Pg270
--- --- --- --- --- --- Investigated by
Steve Thomas
Ron Gosage

John found her in phone book, sat outside her apartment complex six months prior to June 98 interviews


CHAIN OF EVENTS 1997


1997-04-30: John Ramsey Interrogation by Steve Thomas, Tom Trujillo

John Ramsey Interrogation by Steve Thomas, Tom Trujillo
Also present, Pat Burke, Bryan Morgan, Pete Hoffstrom, Jon Foster
April 30, 1997 - Boulder, Colorado
http://www.jonbenetindexguide.com/1997BPD-John-Interview-Complete.htm



ST: Tom, I want to keep going here for a minute, if youíre OK with that. John, as our times is short, you are certainly aware that weíre going to put some hard questions to you today. There is no doubt about that, and we got through it with Patsy and her attorney, and weíll do the same here. But one of the things we ask ourselves is if this was an outside intruder who came into the home and did this, who would bare such a hatred or a grudge. Certainly along those lines, as you know, and my preference would have been to ask you and have done it discretely. But we were made aware of an infidelity of your marriage to Lucinda, and Lucinda shared that. And that has been a person that we have not been able to find, and I can assure you, we asked this as discretely as we could, as you can ask a question like that to certain personís Is that somebody that you would share with us?
JR: Yeah. Her name was Gloria Williams. This was in the late 70ís. She worked for us, for me, for three or four years I guess.
ST: APG?
JR: No, this was before all that. This was, she worked for, well the company that was formed with this New York group was called Southern Peripherals Instruments. And she worked for that company. We had her as a secretary. And that company, I donít remember exactly when we closed it down, but it would have been, well letís see, kind of would been 79 or 80, cause I think it was before Patsy and I got married.
ST: Do you have any idea if she is still in the Atlanta area?
JR: I donít know. I have seen her in, since then. But she was, itís really one of those things your regret in life, but she was also a very, you heard of the movie Fatal Attraction, I didnít go see it because I think I could have written it.
ST: Well, with that said John, is she somebody that bares further inquiry in this case?
JR: It seems like a stretch since itís been so long. But if I think back in my past and there was people that Iíve angered, certainly I angered her.
ST: If we continue to have some sort of working relationship, is that something that certainly through our attorney, you might assist us with?
JR: Iíd be happy to.



1997-04-30: Patsy Ramsey Interrogation by Steve Thomas, Tom Trujillo

Patsy Ramsey Interrogation by Steve Thomas, Tom Trujillo
Also present, Pat Burke, Bryan Morgan, Pete Hoffstrom, Jon Foster
April 30, 1997 - Boulder, Colorado
http://www.jonbenetindexguide.com/1997BPD-Patsy-Interview-Complete.htm



ST: Okay. One person that we have not been able to run down, that I certainly want to exhaust in this ting is uh, a woman who Lucinda revealed to us is having had an affair with John that ultimately lead to the dissolution of their marriage. Um, that was some time ago, but, um, I think people have been reluctant to share that with us. Do you know who this person was?
PR: No, Iím not aware of anything like that.
ST: Are, are you aware of prior to today, because I had to ask Nedra and Pam and Paulie and uh, if they were aware of this person, while we were in Georgia so we could find her, and make sure sheís not some kook that laid in wait for 20 years. . .
PR: Um hum.
ST: . . .um, is today the first time youíve been made, made aware of this woman?
PR: I donít know of any woman with, I donít know anything about this, no.
ST: Okay. Are you aware that John had some sort of infidelity according to Lucinda?
PR: No (Inaudible).
ST: Okay. So you certainly wouldnít know this womanís name then?
PR: No.
ST: And youíre not in a position so Iíll ask John if heíll share that with us. Letís get off that for a minute and Iím going to let Tom take you back into the 24th and 25th.



CHAIN OF EVENTS 1998


[John Ramsey, June 1998 Interviews]1998-06-23: John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane
(Screen Capture from "CBS 48 Hours Investigates - Searching for a Killer" 10/04/2002)

John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane
Present also were Bryan Morgan, PI David Williams
June 23, 24, 25, 1998 - Boulder, Colorado


http://www.jonbenetindexguide.com/1998BPD-John-Interview-Complete.htm

June 1998 John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane (Gloria Williams)

0476
17 MIKE KANE: What other things have
18 you done yourself to investigate this? I mean
19 outside of hiring people to do it, besides --
20 (MULTIPLE SPEAKERS).
21 JOHN RAMSEY: Tried to put my
22 brain to it, just to try to figure out what
23 these clues mean, this person's life force. I
24 have given every possible -- you think back,
25 who you had a conference with, going way back,

0477
1 and I tried to give those names to our people,
2 and instructed them to share that with you. He
3 have -- I was trying to --
unfortunately I had
4 an affair 20 something years ago and I was
5 trying to figure out where this person was and I
6 looked in the phone book and I found the
7 addresses of, there are several with her name
8 and I wanted it to seem logical, she used to
9 live in the area, went to an apartment complex
10 and sat there for a while, to see if I could see
11 her come and go.
12 MIKE KANE: When was that?
13 JOHN RAMSEY: Oh, I don't know,
14 six months ago, something like that.
So you
15 know, it's -- you know, when Patsy and I have
16 talked about, you know, of course we have the
17 media hounding us to talk to them all the time
18 and I think we both kind of concluded that if
19 this thing ever dies down, we are going to
20 sister it up again. We want to keep the
21 pressure on.
One thing we think we can do is
22 keep the pressure on the killer.
23 LOU SMIT: Could I interject
24 you're talking about Gloria Williams?
25 JOHN RAMSEY: (Nodding).

0478
1 LOU SMIT: Have you ever thought,
2 you know you had claimed in that first letter
3 you sent to me or in the letter that was sent to
4 me, that she had kind of a fatal attraction type
5 personality. How did you attribute that? I
6 mean --
7 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, just -- we
8 hired her as a secretary in a small office, and
9 you know, I was vulnerable, but not -- not
10 crossing the line. We were at a Christmas party
11 that this office building had, she said gee, I
12 left something up in my office, do you have a
13 key? And so I went up, unlocked the door and as
14 soon as the door unlocked she turned around and
15 kissed me. And then I just kind of got sucked
16 in. But it was a, just a very strong physical
17 attraction.
18 LOU SMIT: How long did that last
19 for?
20 JOHN RAMSEY: Oh, two years,
21 maybe. It was one of the things I got into and
22 I couldn't get out. She was extremely
23 aggressive. Like you know, I tried to, you know
24 --
25 LOU SMIT: What do you mean

0479
1 aggressive?
2 JOHN RAMSEY: I wouldn't answer
3 the phone so she would call 27 times.
4 LOU SMIT: At home?
5 JOHN RAMSEY: At home. Our
6 marriage probably wasn't strong or that wouldn't
7 have happened at all, but it certainly ended it.
8 And it was probably the biggest regret I have in
9 my life, but she was a very volatile person.
10 LOU SMIT: Why do you think she
11 hasn't surfaced? I mean your name has been all
12 over the place.
13 JOHN RAMSEY: I don't know. And
14 that really surprises me. I am surprised she
15 hasn't come forward and said, that son of a
16 bitch, you know, I knew him when.
17 LOU SMIT: Was it a bad breakup
18 that you had?
19 JOHN RAMSEY: Yeah, and I got rid
20 of her finally. You know I just couldn't, I
21 finally got her to stop pursuing me.
22 LOU SMIT: But did she make any
23 threats?
24 JOHN RAMSEY: No. No. Not --
25 that was 20 years ago, or longer than that

0480
1 maybe.
2 LOU SMIT: And you have never
3 heard from her since?
4 JOHN RAMSEY: No.
5 LOU SMIT: Do you know if she had
6 any children?
7 JOHN RAMSEY: She had a son, I
8 think I read his name in the note but I forget
9 it now. I think I was reading the note,
10 whatever the name was, Scott or Mark -- Mark
11 Williams, Mark Williams. It was probably 20
12 years ago, he was probably nine years old or so.


(SNIP)

.

June 1998 John Ramsey Interrogation by Lou Smit and Mike Kane (Gloria Williams)

0486
1 MIKE KANE: Just to follow up on
2 what Lou was saying about Gloria Williams.
You
3 said you finally put a stop to it, or called and
4 said -- how did you do it?
5 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, it was
6 actually Patsy indirectly or unknowingly helped
7 that. I met Patsy, she was one of the first
8 persons I met that I really cared about, and
9 wanted to -- I always kind of thought she was
10 kind of a gift from my mother to help me get my
11 life straightened out, who had died ten years
12 before.
13 But Patsy and I were down, we were
14 downstairs in the apartment, she was staying
15 cooking hamburgers, and I went upstairs to get
16 some more wine, and when I got up there, this
17 Gloria had called and said she was coming over
18 and I didn't want it to mess up my -- what was
19 just starting to be a relationship with Patsy.
20 And so I left the apartment, I just left. I
21 didn't want her to find me anywhere.
22 And she came over and was
23 apparently knocking on my door and Patsy by this
24 time was thinking, where in the world did I go?
25 She said she came upstairs, she tells the story

0487
1 later she came upstairs with these two wine
2 glasses and here is this woman standing and
3 knocking on my door and she said well, where is
4 he? And this Gloria says he is in with her.
5 Patsy said her, her who? She said Patsy. Oh,
6 well, I was just bringing these wine glasses
7 back.
8 She was smooth as a cucumber, and
9 later that evening, I came back, kind of told
10 her what had happened, I said I had this
11 girlfriend that was crazy and I just didn't want
12 it to -- and so I said I was going to stay
13 there that night and sleep on the couch, because
14 I didn't want to be in my apartment and we were
15 just talking and knock, knock, knock on the
16 door, and -- actually I think I was going to
17 leave. There was a knock on the door, and I was
18 literally behind the door, Patsy opened the
19 door, it's Gloria, and she said I was waiting
20 for John, I want to come in, use your phone and
21 Patsy, "oh, our phone is out of order, we just
22 moved in."
23 And here I was standing behind the
24 door, I was -- then she just was -- and from
25 that moment -- first of all, from that moment

0488
1 on, Gloria left me alone and I also realized how
2 much, what a significant person Patsy was.
3 Because here she was a 23-year-old, just
4 standing there. So that was kind of the
5 breaking point.
6 LOU SMIT: Have you been able to
7 locate her at all?
8 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, I don't know,
9 but I am very surprised that she hasn't
10 surfaced.
11 LOU SMIT: That is kind of an
12 unusual thing.
13 JOHN RAMSEY: Yeah.


(SNIP)


0693
19 MIKE KANE: All right. Are there
20 any big secrets you kept from Patsy?
21 JOHN RAMSEY: No. No. Not that I
22 can think of.
23 MIKE KANE: Do you think there was
24 any big secrets she ever kept from you?
25 JOHN RAMSEY: No. No. I doubt

0694
1 that very much.
2 MIKE KANE: Why? Why is that?
3 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, you live with
4 somebody for 18 years, it's pretty hard to keep
5 secrets for one thing, I guess. I don't know
6 what a big secret is but --
7 MIKE KANE: How did you keep the
8 Gloria Williams secret from Cindy?
9 JOHN RAMSEY: Well, that was
10 ultimately not possible, obviously.
11 MIKE KANE: But I think you said
12 two years?
13 JOHN RAMSEY: No. We were
14 divorced after two years, I think. But I think
15 that affair probably went on for eight months or
16 a year maybe. Before it exploded.
17 MIKE KANE: Before she found out
18 about it?
19 JOHN RAMSEY: Uh-hum.
20 MIKE KANE: But you were able to
21 maintain it for that period of time?
22 JOHN RAMSEY: (Nodding).

CHAIN OF EVENTS 1999


[Perfect Murder, Perfect Town]1999-02-18: "Perfect Murder, Perfect Town, JonBenet and the City of Boulder"
Written by Lawrence Schiller, February 18, 1999


PMPT Page 462sb

"During the first days of June, the DA's office received a phone call from Patsy Ramsey. Alex Hunter was out. Patsy left a message that the family was leaving for Charlevoix on June 6 now that Burke was done with school for the year. Lou Smit, who had been driving by the Ramsey's house each morning at 7:00 A.M. to look around and say a prayer for JonBenet, happened to be at the their home when Patsy and John drove by on June 6. Seeing an opportunity to develop a relationship with the Ramseys, he waved to them. John stopped his car and got out. Smit greeted Ramsey and the two men stood on the front lawn chatting. It was the first, time the investigator had met either of the Ramseys. A moment later Patsy joined them and Smit invited the couple into his van to continue the conversation. Just before the Ramseys departed, Patsy told Smit that she and her husband had nothing to do with the death of JonBenet. They wanted the killer to be caught, she repeated. Then the Ramseys and Smit joined hands and prayed together that the detective would find JonBenet's killer and this nightmare would soon end. Smit continued to stop each day at the scene of the crime on his way to work to pray for JonBenet.

It wasn't long after that Smit received a letter from John Ramsey. The worst thing that I have ever done in my life, Ramsey wrote, is that I once committed adultery when I was married to my first wife. I wanted you to hear it from me, Ramsey continued, before you read it in some tabloid."

CHAIN OF EVENTS 2000


[JonBenet, Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation]2000-04-11: ďJonBenet, Inside the Ramsey Murder InvestigationĒ
by Steve Thomas and Don Davis, April 11, 2000


ST Page 173

"I asked about the infidelity in his first marriage. He identified the woman as Jodi Roberts, who worked for him as a secretary in the late seventies. "I haven't seen her since then," he said. "It was certainly one of those things you regret in life. When I heard of the movie Fatal Attraction, we didn't go see it because I think I could have written it." I considered that to be a very peculiar answer because if Roberts was such a menace, why was he only now supplying her name, when he had given up so many other people, including close friends, as murder suspects? We asked about any other suspects. He mentioned business associates from the eighties, former Access employees, the cleaning lady."


(SNIP)


ST Page 270

"While in Atlanta, I could also knock on the door of John Ramsey's former mistress, Jodi Roberts, and interview her. Ramsey had described her as being very emotional and claimed that she "seduced" him. In the April interviews, he described her as a vengeful person, but hadn't offered any clues as to where we could find her. I had spent a year tracking her down, and friends described her as a sweet, beautiful lady. Somebody was wrong.

Cops know that talking to former lovers can provide a treasure chest of information that the person being investigated would just as soon keep hushed up. Since we had to clear Roberts as a suspect anyway, I wanted to hear what she had to say about her affair with John Ramsey.

When I suggested going to Atlanta, Beckner asked if I could interview Roberts by phone instead. The same day I was told the budget could not cover an airline ticket, but Chief Koby hired a new consultant to provide "emotional survival training" for the police department's executive staff.

Another year would pass before detectives flew to Atlanta to talk with the ex-mistress. Agent John Lang of the Georgia Bureau of Investigation eventually obtained the Paugh family's prints, in the presence of their lawyer."

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